Also dont forget folk he called all Wormholers, all of us, dumb.

Dear foz
I know you have good intentions with this new mecanic but I'd just like to say the time for "nice talk" is over.
This spawn mecanic is ****
And instead of scraping it you go and add anew variable to it
You are screwing over the small corps that live in wh space
I hope you get trapped in wh space with a head full of implants with an insufficient clone

And every player who thinks that those ubercoalitions have lost their edge as player-made content-generators and small groups need more love, "Z" up.

so,

Z

I'd probably define it as the character you do the most activities with, the most chats / convos with, or the most roles in an alliance/corp, not counting ceo holding toons.

WHs where never been meant to be inhabitated and POSsed. The POS code was simply forgotten - nowadays many WHs have multiple POSs.

Players tend to abuse game mechanics - WHs are nothing than ISK cows - and with the rolling of holes WH ppl even had and have the chance to control access to their WH.

What we see is a try to make EVE more risk versus reward.

Today ppl even build stuff and do PI in WHs - WHs (C1s) are a kind of industrial base.

Hey guys. I wanted to post again to make sure it's clear that we are not ignoring this thread and that we will be continuing to keep a close eye on your feedback and on changes in player behavior.

I completely understand that some of you are feeling anger over the fact that we disagree about how this change will play out. We wish we could please everyone at all times but unfortunately that isn't always possible.

Yes logging off and doing nothing is totally valid and denying me kills is fine but its defeating the point of this change, if people arent prepared to roll the wh cos its to risky why even change it. Having it so you can jump back attually gives smaller groups a chance to fight bigger groups by slamming the door in there face and limiting numbers to a level they can fight.

I didnt mention anything about unsubbing at all. I said people are leaving wh space several corps have already done this. one is also looking at leaving or merging.

but if you could please let me know the stuff about what wh's you have lived in and for how long.

yeah I wasn't indicting you specifically, you were the one poster who actually was able to nut up and call me out despite my mistake happening many pages ago

was just marveling at how poorly the rest of you all are fighting for your lives here

oh please

I didn't make my mistake for several pages and there you all were reciting your "wormhole players are the only people authorized to make changes" creed way before I even allowed myself the rope to make a mistake

Really? That's funny, because "these guys" have been accusing CCP of having no experience with w-space. I should think that it'd be apparently at this point that you do need to explain these things, regardless of how obvious they seem to you. That seems to be your best hope at convincing them why you feel this is a bad change.

What are you smoking have you even tested this? A phoenix on average will be 15km from the hole plus or minus a couple of km with a minimum of 12 as I have tested this myself today multiple times with different dreads carriers etc.

It seems like things have gotten a bit out of hand in this thread.

I can fully appreciated that some of you are unhappy with the changes that have gone out.

If you feel strongly about these changes, then give civil and concise feedback in the Hyperion feedback thread, and I'll point the development team in that direction.

Please don't make personal attacks on eachother, or employees of CCP, otherwise you'll lose the ability to post on the forums, and neither us nor you want it to come to that.

While you may see our development staff as avatars on a forum, please be aware that there are in fact people behind these faces, and abuse of CCP and our volunteers will not be tolerated.

Pull your head out of your ass and go look at this thread and the unofficial thread for feedback about how the community changes. Beyond that, you have a ****** public reputation for lying to the family members of those laid off so remind us again why we should take your or any other CCP member at face value? All you do is lie, obfuscate, and ignore.

I would call you many things but that would just get me banned right.

I will call you one thing.

Liar.

Edit: this isn't a personal attack, just stating a fact.

It was a clear example of a copy and paste script that they were given. CCP Falcon did not read anything he was just told to make a post with that script so he did it.

Okay, so I came in a little more gently last time, because I know that there's quite a few people who don't like this particular change.

A large proportion of our development staff also play the game, myself included. At times, I don't agree with changes that are being made. However, I do exactly what the vast majority of other people do when a change is made that I don't like - I adapt to what's happened and adjust how I play to suit.

This thread was created over a month ago, and a big chunk of the valuable feedback has been drowned out by people ranting and abusing both CCP and eachother, hence why I asked for concise feedback in the Hyperion feedback thread.

If you guys want to keep it here, feel free to do so, but don't complain if feedback gets removed because it's packed in with ranting and personal attacks.

So, simple instruction for you guys out of your reaction to my previous post:

Here are the forum rules. Follow them, or scroll down and read what happens when you break them. It's that simple.

We have no problem with you guys voicing your concerns. In fact, I did the same for a decade as a player when I felt CCP had done something wrong. We do however have issues with people breaking the forum rules.

Carry on discussing this. I'll point people here, and look at collecting feedback to send to development. However, don't break the forum rules.

Clearly she did not as previously pointed out,
-+ 10% is 20 percent, so she has already what she wanted

Hopefully we can actually get Some one who actually has responsibility to make a decision read this forum thread and see what the effect on the community of this "delightful" change has been.

He may not be well pleased with the result.

Probably not what he expected.

Message to the decision Maker in question within CCP.

All the solutions to the self created problem are clearly explained within. Feedback has been clearly provided as requested.

If you need more information Please speak to the WH CSM. He may clarify any points.

I believe we have complied with the meaning of Feedback response as defined in the majority of dictionaries?

I made 2 bil in 4 hours FW missions.

stuff

FYI, I also use an NPC corp main. I have two other "mains" that have slightly less SP than this toon, and they are in a corp that has a wormhole presence, but that corp also has a lot of highsec noobs that we are training/introducing to lower class wormholes and so, as a courtesy I don't post with those corp toons to reduce the likelihood of handing them a griefer wardec.

As for posting using a forum alt vs. posting on a WH corp main, FWIW (not much) as long as you have some interesting commentary to share about the mass/distance change I don't really care what avatar you use. But if you post ****, then expect to get called out for it. That is all.

Back on topic, at this point given the lack of response from Fozzie/CCP I've assumed the mass/spawn distance change was considered one of those "for the good of the game" changes that was put in against all the player feedback. An analogous situation would be if CCP were to propose a sledgehammer nerf to Ishtars or Sentry Drones. The tears would be unbelievable, but CCP puts the change in anyway "for the good of the game" etc. That's where I think we're at here.

The intended behavior change, along with the new uncrashable frigate holes and extra random holes was to:

1. Discourage "locking up" your w-space system for farming with relative security.
2. Discourage rage-rolling to find content, and instead encourage players to explore the additional naturally spawned chains instead.
3. To increase the risk of "doing things" in w-space generally.

I'm saying so.



Listen to the wormhole townhall and podcasts with CCP Fozzie discussing the wormhole changes. That is the impression that I got. You may get a different impression, but what I posted is the impression I got.

The Ishtar/Sentry Drone analogy was only given to communicate by analogy the CCP/player base dynamic I believe we're in the middle of currently. Its rather pointless for you to run with it.

The recruiting sub-forum especially is commonly used by "griefer" corps fishing for one-sided wardecs. But yeah this is the wrong thread for this discussion...

Actually, he did. He said they spotted it on the forums in a "we want your little things" thread (blame Chitsa for that, the original idea was his) and then it was something that was pushed forward by last years CSM (suprise suprise, Chitsa again, who has ****** off to be a scrub in lowsec). So basically what Fozzie said was: "We read it, thought it was an awesome idea and then implemented it because we can".

Anyone remember the ice miner tears? 95% were against the change to remove unlimited ice. Now ice mining is better and more profitable then ever.

Adapt and quit crying. The only mistake CCP made was letting safe-holes go on for this long.

I still find it very hard to believe that a human could fail the turing test.
But you are right, that would fail to work too, once the attitude becomes prevalent, that your customers are the enemy, then there is little hope left.

i wonder how long the above post of mine lasts before some ccp or isd deletes it because they want to be treated with oh so much respect but wont treat us the same.

edit: this is the reason i dont care if i get banned from posting on the forums http://i.imgur.com/jSSfu4V.jpg oh and i pay with plex so no need to worry about actually cancelling anything as i just don't buy plex

If anyone has an idea for action on what to do about CCP, this is the time to speak up.

With their new 6 week dev cycles there are going to be new changes out in 5 weeks.

I have not seen anything about what they are going to **** up next but when they do it, again without any time for feedback, their attention is going to move further away from WH. (Not that they are listening anyhow.)

Why would they not have an orca? It fit's in to a c3, never mind a c4.
And building one certainly isn't that hard.

Freighters can use gates. Freighters constantly get caught 15km of a gate after jumping through it. Freighters can't instantly jump back.
Wormholes are not Stargates, you are right one way, but Stargates are Wormholes. Educate yourself on EVE lore.

As for Cynos, yes, also artificial Wormholes. And a lot of people have been wanting Cynos to have exactly this kind of slight scatter to stop exactly what you are talking about. Risk free Cap movement to a cyno on a station.

So.... Some angry Nullbears, a lot of happy other players that risk free cap movement went away, to answer your question.

---

Edit, oh, and Orca's can use gates also. Who also spawn further off a gate than they do off a WH, so have even longer to burn back.